Where do we go from here?

[Keith W]

The broadcast e-mail that I sent out last week about the membership limitations of our Ning service provoked a number of reactions that I'd like to open up to discussion by the group. I had a couple of new people who were concerned that they would be cut from the membership roster because they hadn't posted anything yet, so it seems I could have worded my announcement a little more clearly. If anybody needs to be cut, I will start with the oldest accounts first, and only those who had never posted anything. A message will be sent notifying them before they are removed, so they will have a chance to respond with a reason why they shouldn't be cut. Nobody will be summarily cut from the group without warning.

 

For anybody who has taken the time to read my posting on how this group got started, you know that it came down to a matter of convenience that would provide a much-needed forum without all the extra work it would take to code a forum on my Everglades Diary website. If I had the time, I would much rather have done that, but as anybody who has visited the Diary lately can see, it's in a pretty sad state because I am unable to devote the time necessary to keep it up to date, let alone expand it to include a forum that would require a fair amount of admin time, which Ning takes care of for me.

 

The Mini subscription that we now have costs $19.95/year, and limits us to 150 members. The Plus subscription, which would give us unlimited memership, costs $19.95/month, or $199.95/year, quite a jump in price. I have no problem covering the $19.95, but $199.95 is a bit much. I've had some generous offers to help pay for the premium service, but after some thought in regard to accepting donations or charging a membership fee, I'm not sure that I want to open up that particular can of worms at this point, for the same reasons that the group exists in the first place.

 

Therefore, I believe it's time that we as a group begin thinking about how we want to move forward, and there are many questions that will need to be addressed and answered. What do you think we should do? Should we solicit donations to upgrade, or charge a membership fee? What issues would that possibly raise in terms of access and editorial control? Would you consider volunteering to help out with site admin duties if that became necessary? Should we be looking at alternatives to Ning, and if so, what are they? What about soliciting ads from local outfitters and guide services to help pay for the service? 

Let me know what you think...

[Kim Gass]

I would be happy to donate but perhaps if you have an "advisory board" of some web savvy folks you might be able to keep the reliance on donations at a minimum and be able to key in some relevant advertising resources. I would like to see links to local businesses,shuttles, tent friendly camping in the car etc. I am with Vivian re advertising of Everglades specific services. (last year I hunted for a laundromat!)

I am afraid that by limiting access you are cutting off your own head. No advertiser is going to want limited exposure. I would like to see the scope of this site expanded actually.

And for someone like me who is going to wield a snowshovel in the AM and really needs local information, it can be a win win for service providers. After all I am not running home right after my trip. And increasingly I think ( for better or worse) there will be more "paddlehead snowbirds" who might visit the Glades if they know of support services.

[Wayne Wells]

I think Keith should weigh in on what his expectations for the board are. Keith built the board. At the risk of sounding like a total dweeb, I would like to hear what Keith's expectations are for the board, going forward.
I personally enjoy the intimacy of the board in it's current form, but know that a broader audience base will probably yield much more Florida and Everglades oriented information than can be gleaned from a few dozen folks.
Personally, I'd like to see the EEN become the site for the Everglades NP, and I'd be more than willing to help with the web aspects of the site.

Seeing that the Everglades NP, via the "Flamingo Master Plan" is moving forward, I would hope that the EEN could become a voice for the park, if folks are willing.

[toofaraway]

Gary raises a good point. Do we want everyone in the world to know every intimate detail of exploring the glades via this site or should the site be a resource for those who really do like to "go deep"?

If the former, then it should be the plus subscription with ads etc.

If the latter, then it should be a subscription only site, limited to 150 folks who can then really share their best info.

I vote for the latter. Not trying to be a snob but because 1) all the basic info about glades travel is already out there if one looks for it and 2) I have seen what happens when everyone in the world is made aware of your best secret spot. Next time you go there you won't be able to go there....

[Bob Quirk]

I'm good for a donation just let us know where to send it.

[Keith W]

My expectations are that we can continue to keep this forum alive and open to all who want to join, without it becoming my second job. It isn't my expectations that are in question here, however, and what I hoped to hear are your own expectations.

The generous offers for donations will be considered, along with the various legalities that this entails. Wayne's question can be answered now: "What does the site do with the extra money if more folks than are required, sign up?" Answer: no donations would be accepted beyond what is needed to pay for the Plus subscription. It was never my intention that this become a for-profit venture.

I'll also explore the possibility of paid sponsorships, but I'm not sure that we can get the traffic that would sustain them. Sponsors tend to want some bang for their buck and I don't know what we could deliver for them.

[Wayne Wells]

How many people ultimately volunteered to help pay? Not sure if some sent via email or some other venue.
I didn't see that much enthusiasm via "I'll help pay" type posts.
When I first asked the question of extra money, I was perhaps expecting more of a turnout in that regards. Someone said 10 people at 20 bucks a head, and I was thinking more folks would volunteer, driving the per person cost down, not that there was a profit motive.
I guess I was hoping 20-30 people would have said "I'll help" considering you are at the maximum allowable user limit.

Out of the 150, how many are essentially old, idle accounts?
Why not just purge out the old, idle accounts?
I get dumped from lists like this on occasion that I don't use maybe once a year. I'm not offended when I find that I've been dumped for inactivity, I just sign back up.
I think that will solve your problem quite effectively.

You only need to be a member to post, right?

[jwoodys]

I agree with donations...count me in! I think adds would help too.

[Wayne Wells]

I'm going to try an upload a spreadsheet that I just put together that might help.
I went to the "All Members" section and starting at the bottom I worked my way up each page, going from right to left.
The spreadsheet should reflect a few things if the formatting came through.
Green filled line items are people that joined but have never posted.
Red filled line items are folks that have posted, but their most recent posts are over a year ago. There are a few of these folks who posted in 11/2009 that have asterisks by their name signifying the "within a year" aspect.
People with no shading are active participants.
I stopped when I got to people joining in 11/2009 as this is within a year of today.
This yielded 36 folks who joined and that was their last act.
12 more fall outside of the posting within a year rule that I generated.
They may visit regularly, who knows, but I assume that anyone can visit, it is just posting that requires joining.

Hope this helps. Not trying to cause trouble but I said I'd help and perhaps this is a starting point.

[toofaraway]

I forgot to mention in my post above that I'm happy to donate as well.

TFA

[Keith W]

I do appreciate everybody's offers to donate and I'll keep this in mind for the future. We had enough voluntary removals to give us some leeway for new members for another couple of months. Nobody has expressed a desire for more functionality (chat, event postings, etc.) so I will leave the group as it is for now. If it comes down to a need for money to keep this thing going, I'll explore soliciting ads or sponsorships before I ask for individual donations. Thank you all for your input!

[Esther Luft]

Late response but I just saw this. Take the money. It's not like you can run fast in sawgrass. We all benefit from the site and the open sharing of information. I know I wasted more than $20 on junk I didn't need, want or use. There are lots of donation only sponsored sites. Allow those of us willing to donate to become your sponsors. If you happen to end up with a few extra bucks, you hold an event for sponsors, we paddle, drag, hike, and buy us each a beer. Oh,wait, that may blow the surplus. We buy you a beer : ) I'm just saying, you have support and we ALL appreciate this site immensely. Avoid commercialization,please.

[Billy Pugh]

Count subthemariner in